Discussion:
Glueup time?
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Frank
2013-08-26 21:10:28 UTC
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Time needed to glue a guitar top to the ribs, using hot hide glue? Seems like the glue would gel before getting halfway through setting the clamps. What's the workaround trick, gluing in sections? YouTube is no help, oddly. Seems like this should be a common question.
tommyboy
2013-08-27 03:29:07 UTC
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On Mon, 26 Aug 2013 14:10:28 -0700 (PDT), Frank
Post by Frank
Time needed to glue a guitar top to the ribs, using hot hide glue? Seems like the glue would gel before getting halfway through setting the clamps. What's the workaround trick, gluing in sections? YouTube is no help, oddly. Seems like this should be a common question.
Hide Glue in sections or use Fish Glue.
Nick Odell
2013-08-30 19:59:42 UTC
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Post by Frank
Time needed to glue a guitar top to the ribs, using hot hide glue? Seems like the glue would gel before getting halfway through setting the clamps. What's the workaround trick, gluing in sections? YouTube is no help, oddly. Seems like this should be a common question.
Usual disclaimers apply. And I hope I'm not trying to teach my granny to
suck eggs!

I've only used hide glue with classical strings and re-fitting the belly
onto a cello isn't really equivalent to gluing a top on a guitar: for a
start, I can use a thinner concentration between top and ribs because
under stress the top/rib joint is in compression, not tension and
because it makes it easier to take that top off again next time I need
to take it apart to repair.

Hide glue is self-clamping: in other words, as it sets, it draws
everything together so, provided the parts all fit, spool clamps are
perfectly sufficient to hold it all in place.

Hide glue starts to gel as it cools so keeping things warm and moist
slows this process down. Work in a warm room that's not excessively dry;
use table-lamps or similar with filament bulbs to project warmth as well
as light on the work; pre-heat the pieces that you want to glue and it
should work.

My sequence goes something like this:

-put everything together in a "dry run." Set out all your spool clamps
so they are ready to slip on and will only need a quick twist to tighten.

-warm up the parts. I have a 1950s electric drying cabinet and, while it
was designed to air clothes, it is capable of gently and evenly warming
through the pieces of wood.

-get the pre-prepared hide glue ready to use. I'm guessing (only
guessing because, as I said, I haven't done this exact job before) but
since one uses a thin mix for a violin belly and a thick mix for a
violin back, a medium consistency is probably right for a guitar top.

- remove the top from the heat source and quickly brush the glue around
the joint. put the top down to one side under the warmth of the table lamps

-get the sides from the heat source, apply the glue, put the parts
together (all this under the warming lights) , slip on the spool clamps,
clean it up and you are done. I always glue the top first because the
thicker wood of the top will act as a heat store and retain warmth, and
therefore liquidity, better than the ribs.

Finally, one of the other great features of hide glue is its
reversibility. If you are not satisfied with your first attempt, take it
apart, clean it up and do it again.

Nick
Frank
2013-08-30 21:22:18 UTC
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Post by Nick Odell
Post by Frank
Time needed to glue a guitar top to the ribs, using hot hide glue? Seems like the glue would gel before getting halfway through setting the clamps. What's the workaround trick, gluing in sections? YouTube is no help, oddly. Seems like this should be a common question.
Usual disclaimers apply. And I hope I'm not trying to teach my granny to
suck eggs!
I've only used hide glue with classical strings and re-fitting the belly
onto a cello isn't really equivalent to gluing a top on a guitar: for a
start, I can use a thinner concentration between top and ribs because
under stress the top/rib joint is in compression, not tension and
because it makes it easier to take that top off again next time I need
to take it apart to repair.
Hide glue is self-clamping: in other words, as it sets, it draws
everything together so, provided the parts all fit, spool clamps are
perfectly sufficient to hold it all in place.
Hide glue starts to gel as it cools so keeping things warm and moist
slows this process down. Work in a warm room that's not excessively dry;
use table-lamps or similar with filament bulbs to project warmth as well
as light on the work; pre-heat the pieces that you want to glue and it
should work.
-put everything together in a "dry run." Set out all your spool clamps
so they are ready to slip on and will only need a quick twist to tighten.
-warm up the parts. I have a 1950s electric drying cabinet and, while it
was designed to air clothes, it is capable of gently and evenly warming
through the pieces of wood.
-get the pre-prepared hide glue ready to use. I'm guessing (only
guessing because, as I said, I haven't done this exact job before) but
since one uses a thin mix for a violin belly and a thick mix for a
violin back, a medium consistency is probably right for a guitar top.
- remove the top from the heat source and quickly brush the glue around
the joint. put the top down to one side under the warmth of the table lamps
-get the sides from the heat source, apply the glue, put the parts
together (all this under the warming lights) , slip on the spool clamps,
clean it up and you are done. I always glue the top first because the
thicker wood of the top will act as a heat store and retain warmth, and
therefore liquidity, better than the ribs.
Finally, one of the other great features of hide glue is its
reversibility. If you are not satisfied with your first attempt, take it
apart, clean it up and do it again.
Nick
Gluing clamshell-type cigar boxes shut. The biggest selling
points for hide glue for me are its reversibility, easy
cleanup, and better-looking finish -- no glue lines where
cured yellow glue resists stain. I can reduce the number
of clamps to 4 by planing the joints a hair convex, creating a
sprung joint, which only needs to be clamped at the ends.
d***@gmail.com
2013-09-02 05:04:04 UTC
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Post by Frank
Time needed to glue a guitar top to the ribs, using hot hide glue? Seems like the glue would gel before getting halfway through setting the clamps. What's the workaround trick, gluing in sections? YouTube is no help, oddly. Seems like this should be a common question.
I don't use HHG for this kind of reason. I'm a very slow worker. I'll have to try some time. Cleanup and clamp times should be improved over Titebond.

I read something in I think the GAL publication, where the luthier paints on the HHG and then lets it set a bit before putting the top in place, basically dry. Then he uses a portable spot steamer to reactivate the HHG as he works around the circumference.

He does restoration work on cellos, IIRC. Which would be an even bigger problem than a guitar, I would guess.

Dave Hajicek

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